The last few days have been pretty rough...cold, wind, and pretty much every form of precipitation imaginable. Despite these less than perfect conditions our guides/clients that stuck it out enjoyed a very quite river and some fantastic fishing! Good numbers of Grey Reef sized trout and even one monster caught by Richard De Petris of Rockwall, TX.
17 comments:
Please explain to me ant the others reading your blogs what an AWESOME day of fishing is? What are the numbers of fish in the boat does that entail? And the same for Excellent.
By the way, My self and 4 other friends were up there this past weekend and since your guides put in front of us, we decided to follow the pros.
I'm not so sure your Awesome and Excellent (fish counts) are, how do I day this politically. Well, let just say they are like the Federal Government, not to be trusted fully.
And by the way, you should tell your guides they are not the only ones who go to the sunset bar, I'm sure your clients wouldn't like the comments made about them.
I don't wright the fishing reports, but I am a source for their information, as are flyshop patrons and other guides. Also the reports come right out of our clients mouths. Awesome and excellent are really relative terms. For a totally rookie flyfisherman to land 10-15 fish in a day would be pretty awesome. That same day an experienced fisherman might land twice that or better. An awesome day for a client might mean that they learned some new techniques or that we were able to "break the code" when fishing got tough. Numbers are really trivial and that is not the most important thing that we worry about. Also, awesome could mean we landed a huge fish that day. It sounds like you had a frustrating time on the river and you are trying to blame it on somebody. There is plenty of water out there so following around another boat (guide or private fisherman) is very rude. Since when is fishing a party? If you really what to know what the pros are up to, book a trip. To be fair and honest, I personally had a slower day on Sunday. Wednesday through Saturday really were awesome.
When I formulate a fishing report it most heavily based upon my guides. I also gather information from fly shop patrons and locals. I will be the first to admit the report is not perfect but I do feel it is accurate and honest. When clients get off the river and I ask them "how was your day?" I tend to value their response. In most cases their response is one of the following..."great", "excellent", "awesome"...etc. I think this says something about the quality of our guides. As with anything we get the occasional negative response in which case we address the problem. What would like to see done with the fishing report?? Would you rather I post numbers...ex. Grey Reef is producing 10.2 to 17.9 trout per day per angler?? It's fishing, like Seth said it's all relative.
Trent
I am the one who reported AWESOME fishing on the NPL report. The single in my boat put nearly 40 fish in the net. We spent much of the first couple miles rowing to free ourselves from traffic. We even had an hour of slow to no activity...my problem not the fishing's problem. We were hooking fish on little bugs and always fish barbless so many of the hookups didn't result in a landed fish. But, who cares when you are having such a great time?
Again, the report will never be trivialized by numbers. A portion is about numbers and all of it is about an experience...period. But, when I post the fishing is awesome...it is.
Guides making negative comments about the guests is uncalled for and won't be tolerated. Obviously, I can't take your claim seriously because we don't know who you are or who the guide is or the context of the conversation. But, many of the guests that were out last week are friends of mine who I associate with away from our business. Sometimes as guides we forget that the guest is a customer and they are paying for an experience...and we owe them that respect(because our paycheck is coming from them). We also can get a little caught up in our own egos. We need to remember that we are just fishing guides and our area of expertise, while a fun and satisfying profession, is pretty low in the grand scheme of things.
I considered deleting your post Montana Teal. The comment about being less than truthful is unjustified just because you didn't experience what we experienced. You could have just as easily sent me a private email about the comments made at the Sunset, but instead you chose to try to make us look bad publicly. That speaks volumes.
Erik
As usual, people just don't get it anymore. Success is never measured by "Fish in the net". If that is all a sportsman measures success by, life is going to be pretty miserable, not only in the outdoors, but in careers and in your private life. Fishing and Hunting is about the experience, the memories created, and about the good days and the bad days. Without the challenge, how can there ever be rewards. Without Failure, how can there be success? Success is standing on a pile of failures. Fishing and Hunting is no different. Now, an honest report is just as these honest, hard working owners and guides of NPL have stated, taken directly from their loyal clients mouths. And of course directly from the camera lens. Now, Mr. Montana, if all you "measure" the fishing report by is numbers, then I guess you should go fish a different location. We have a lot of great guides and outfitters here in WY, and none better than those at NPL. If it is so miserable on the North Platte, then please fish somewhere else that you can find "Awesome" numbers. NPL guys, you have the integrity that makes us all very proud to have you representing the natives of WY!!!!
WOW, seemed to have hit a nerve. The dialogue of my observations and readings of NPL and the Reef Fly Shop (they are one in the same under the same umbrella are they not.) have brought out some good points by the owner, employee and resident(s) of the WY area. I for one appreciate your thoughts and comments to what I wrote (and not well I might add) but the essence of my questioning only came from the “reports” that all read. I only wanted clarification of the terms AWSOME, EXCELLENT and good. Which you provided me fully and I thank you for that. I was not the one who said 40 +, nor was I the one who said “clinic”. I was only one of many reading the report and one who wanted clarification after watching the pros. A couple of points that I would like to address please.
1. Congrats on your blog, this one has brought up 6 comments (not including this one I’m writing) it’s the most since the inception of your creation.
2. Just an observation of your reports…when was the last time NPL or RFS had a sub par day fishing? You’ve never posted one; (except for Seth on the 21st of April in the blog itself about his day on the 19th, good for you) check for yourself. I did. So, if you want to be “honest” in your reports, don’t you think some of those, at least one in every season should be reported to keep yourself on the same level as the rest of us disciples? After all, there was but only one perfect person ever born to this earth and even he made one mistake according to the bible.
3. After 22 years of fishing the Reef, (I’ve seen you all come and go in that time) I’ve never really heard anyone boost about them selves in the Reef area like I do in all the other areas I either fish, have fished or read about on the internet. I do understand it’s a business, but just like life, humility does go a long way.
4. Lastly, for the WY “resident”……Since when was a question the basis for a judgment that countered with “go fish a different location”. If we do not ask questions in life, where would knowledge come from so we could measure success by those qualities each of us grade our own lives on? My question came from their printed reports and my observations. And by the way, I guess Mr. WY resident I am blessed by a higher power because every day that I’ve fished…the fishing is excellent to even AWSOME…..My catching on some of those days was a little slow thought. But the fishing was AWSOME.
By the way Reef Shop, your postings are an hour behind the rest of the US. I think you forgot to Spring ahead. You still on Fall behind.
A fishing report is not a cut and dry affair. It would make it easier if there was no emotion involved, but we wouldn't be fishing if it wasn't for emotion. Sub par fishing is rare here. There are sub par mornings or afternoons. But, almost never does the fishing suck...and just when we thought it unanimously sucked one of the guides strolls in and says they had the day of their life. What that means is the fish were happily eating but most of us couldn't stumble onto the solution. Not the fishing's fault...mostly our (the guides) fault.
We don't make the fish eat we just try to get them to sample our offerings. It isn't rocket science.
There are very few hatches at Grey Reef and there are places that the fish like to intersect those hatches. We know there are fish in the river and we know they are in certain locations(they aren't going to crawl up the bank and hide behind a bush)..that's it in a nutshell.
This has been our livelihood for a long time. We spend so much of our lives on the water that it becomes 2nd nature. So if we can't produce on a daily basis we should pack it in. There are lots of other professions where people learn from lots of experience mixed a little luck to become very good at what they do. We are no different. I know of several guides for other local outfitters who also fit this bill.
If you knew Trent or myself you would realize that we enjoy lots of failures. One thing that we refuse to fail at is giving our guests all that we can each and every day. Our guide crew shares that sentiment.
There will be NO apologies for our fishing reports...if you don't like 'em don't read 'em.
Erik
if this was a real blog you wouldn't delete post just because you don't like what they say
Lack of great/excellent/awesome days on the Reef typically means your not working hard enough Montana. There are some days that nothing seems to work for you and the next guy is slayin fish but the fish always eat on the Reef and in 20 years, Montana you should have came to that conclusion a while back. Besides all the miles(17?) of private NPL water... C'mon that explains itself especially on this particular river! I know some of the NPL guides and they know their stuff. I know this fact b/c as a rookie guide this year on the Reef I have found great success from their tips and info provided via the reports you curse. Coincidentally, I guided the days you claimed to be on the Reef, we had to float the same stretch obviously and I probably saw you....and my Client did very well. No monsters, but consistent 16"+ spirited fish all day, all over the river. The second day presented a tough morning, but the afternoon made up for it. After my 2 days of work where up, I floated with friends for 2 more days and didn't work nearly as hard on the sticks and the fishing didn't compare to the 2 days of guiding. Hard work pays off plain and simple. "22 years" should have taught you that.
Finally, a blog with some debate, not just how good Trent and Erik are and their business is doing. I for one found the question of Montana refreshing. He probably could have left out the political part but refreshing. And by the reaction from the guides and owners you’re a little touchy to any one asking for clarification of your terminology.
Boys, if you don’t like other opinions of what other people say, see, hear or read…..don’t have a blog. Just print your reports and go on with life. But for you saying you considered deleting Montana, and deleting another post and not even recognizing that someone else in this world could question your writings. Stick with fishing you seem to be good at it. Your bloggin etiquette needs to be reviewed, and it makes it look like your hiding something.
Montana – You probably could have left out the guide talk at the Sunset. That’s just what guides do and anytime you tell an owner of a fishing company his employees are talking it up he is going to go to bat for them. Grey Reef is no different than any other fishing community. People talk, guides talk, owners talk and we all love them for it. It’s what keeps clients coming back. The fish are always bigger, the big one always gets away and the more you stroke a client the more they love to come back. And when the fishing is as good as it is most times on the Reef, they are repeat clients.
NPL and RFS, if your going to have an interactive blog you should respect your non paying clients as well as your paying clients. After all, your hosting the blog and putting the information out there for them to question.
Remember everyone, keep fishing….it’s fun.
By the way, Montana is right, your posting time stamp is still "fall behind". Catch up! It's blog etiquette.
Boys, Sorry for being behind on the time. And as far as blog etiquette goes I said I considered deleting Montana Teal's post...I didn't delete it. The post I deleted was one that I wrote directed to Montana Teal. I deleted it because I didn't want to do what I was irritated about him doing to us. But, the gist of the deleted post was asking if he was with the group of guys bludgeoning the redds in the afterbay? And if he was why would he give us such a hard time when Trent went out of his way to pack them all across the river in his boat?
We ARE armature blog hosts no doubt. We will never be anything more. The purpose of this blog is for entertainment and info. I really feel like there is so little known about Grey Reef. Like real hatches besides worms and how to fish them. I have never seen the word pseudo in any other report on Grey Reef...why not? They are a very important hatch in the fall.
I am not afraid to be called out. Nor is Trent. But, I have no interest in being involved in a Teton Gravity Reasearch type dialog. This is great, I am happy that there is some quality discussion going on.
Trout Hunter you obviously are close to the situation and are dialed in on the psychology of this gig. But, no such thing as a non paying customer. Just because some one didn't drop a coin in the till this time doesn't mean they won't next time. Treat them poorly and they will never patronize you.
We know we are full of faults. We are just two nobodies trying to step it up a notch.
We would really like some other perspectives...as in article contributions or just photos and descriptions. We don't want to make it appear that we are just preaching at the pulpit.
By the way...the fishing is AWESOME. HA!
Erik
Just to clarify. I felt my original deleted post was inappropriate that is why I deleted it. I repeated it to be honest with all of you. Also, paying "customer" or not everybody deserves our respect and honest information...it is about character not $$. Montana Teal keep 'em coming. You get things rolling!mascheld
No, I’m not close to the situation anymore than any other outfitter. I just enjoy the banter and like to hear both sides. Glad to hear the playing field will be even. I think your blog is great, I’ve enjoyed reading it since you put it up a year ago. Although, I did have to archive it.
The thing that fascinated me the most is the Wyoming attitude from a couple of the bloggers. It’s hard to beat the Poke mentality. Just be careful we Wyomingites don’t come across as belligerent good old boys. I for one enjoy my out of state clients and Montana, your always welcome in my back yard. At least I know you know how to take care of it. Keep up the work NPL, we will all strive to utilize your knowledge and tips in our fishing endeavors. By the way……the fishing today was Fn AWSOME. But we still didn’t boat over 40. I may need to take a trip with you guys in the future.
PS - It would be nice to hear from you again Montana. Were you walking thru reds?
I love to read these debates.
A world without two side to the coin is one not based on American values. I personally have fished the North Platte and it's tributaries for over 15 years. It continually fascinates me and brings me back for more...more of what? Well, just for the pure act of fly fishing. The moment outside of the regular grind, the time to see and be in the great landscape of the area, The time to fish and smile when one connects with me twenty feet out.
Debate and debate on. While you are busy here, I will be busy there wondering what all the fuss is about. Life is too short and the river is long.
(p.s. respect the Reds and the ground they choose to bless us with more.)
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